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ATHEISTS, might I have a Word with you?

This discussion is NOT one of debate.

It's one of research...of genuine interest on my part.

I'm not trying to be clever here, I'm not trying to "lead the witness", none of that.

I'm just interested in receiving your candid feedback regarding the following:

"After holding to your position that God does not exist, you've been presented many reasons from Team Christians as to why He does. Certainly not every claim or argument presented has been entirely dismissed. Assuming it hasn't or that they haven't, I would be extremely interested in knowing what you DO find compelling and persuasive about: a) God being real, and b) Jesus being God.

And why?

I anticipate this being turned around with a parallel discussion started as to what Christians find compelling about the non-believers argument. I think that's fair. If someone would like to start that thread, I'll certainly participate.

But here, for now, I would like to hear from you.

You will find that your responses will not be challenged...my engagement with this discussion will minimal.

I would ask that other Christians not post (except once if you'd like to follow the thread), as this is an open invitation to hear and understand (and listen via the eyes) from the non-believers whom we've engaged. If you are a Christian and have some unbelieving friends or family members, feel free to email them (please) this link and invite them to post a response.

I'm both intrigued to read and anxious to learn.

Thank you in advance for your thoughtful contributions.

Todd

Tags: agnostic, atheism, atheist, belief, god, jesus, unbelief

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Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by LinearC on March 25, 2010 at 9:40pm: Hi Richard,

Thanks!

My starting point is the evidence, and there is no evidence for the existence of any gods.
It really is as simple as that !

cheers,
LC; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Todd Pitner on March 25, 2010 at 9:52pm: LinearC: My starting point is the evidence, and there is no evidence for the existence of any gods.

Then please refute the evidence of "the impossibility of the contrary".

If there is a plausible alternative to "God did it," prove it.

Otherwise, all hat, no cattle, just a bunch of bull.

Todd; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by LinearC on March 25, 2010 at 11:03pm: Hi Todd,

If there is a plausible alternative to "God did it," prove it.

Why should I prove anything? I'm not the one making claims.

And I don't ask proof from you. Just some evidence to support your claim.

cheers,
LC

Permalink Reply by Todd Pitner on March 25, 2010 at 9:35pm: LinearC: Let me define the atheist position for you, it's extremely simple. Atheists do not accept claims that gods exist, on the grounds that no evidence has been presented to support the claim that they do, nor have we found any evidence to support the claim that they do.

Either God exists, or He doesn't...there's no sliding scale. Law of non-contradiction.

So then, it is your default position that He does not, correct?

on the grounds that no evidence has been presented to support the claim that they do,

Are you saying that no evidence has been presented to support the claim that God exists? Well, yes, that's exactly what you just said, word for word. Hmmn, no evidence has been presented to support the claim that God exists.

Wouldn't it be better worded, "no evidence that has been presented to support the claim God exists has been accepted?"

Thus, it's not 'a-theist', but 'reject-theist'?

nor have we found any evidence to support the claim that they do.

Same game as prior.

Todd; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by LinearC on March 25, 2010 at 11:16pm: Hi again Todd,

Either God exists, or He doesn't...there's no sliding scale. Law of non-contradiction.
Agreed.

So then, it is your default position that He does not, correct?
No, not correct.

You claim God exists. You are unable to support the claim with evidence. Therefore I reject the claim.

Your God, or any other god, may very well exist. But in the absence of any evidence that they do exist, then why believe that they do?

Try to think about it another way. How do you feel about the Hindu gods? I assume that you don't believe they exist. Why not? On what grounds do you reject them?

best wishes,
LinearC; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by William on March 27, 2010 at 1:35am: Could you say what you mean by 'evidence?' Please don't go to a dictionary.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Martin Peter Clarke on March 27, 2010 at 1:45am: Evidence.

He means evidence.

Court of law, forensic, clinching, smoking gun, scientific, CSI, despite EVERYTHING to the contrary, evidence.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Martin Peter Clarke on March 27, 2010 at 1:23am: You are SO right Elsie.

NONE has been presented here.

Apart from incontrovertibly and conclusively by myself of course.

All else is dross apart from Kierkegaardian subjective testimony and the declaration of the inclusive dance of God. Perichoresis.

Which envelopes you.

Which is infinitely more sublime than mere proof of God.

All these poor FOOLS who are against you rather than FOR love.

And faithless me who sees the empirical hand of God silhouetted against the empty, dead heavens.; ▶ Reply to This

Permalink Reply by Todd Pitner on March 25, 2010 at 8:11pm: doubtisgood: Todd, Habermas can hardly be said to be unbiased being an American evangelical. If Dawkins made the same claims I might sit up and take note!

That's priceless. Thank you for your honesty.

Todd; ▶ Reply to This

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